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    It seems not really clear to get information about the way the
    author choose to get what he/she declared to happen: "This project
    is open source in the sense that I legally permit people to do
    whatever they want with the source code, design drawings, etc":
    indeed, licence information seems not available, don't it ?<br>
    It sounds a bit like a WTFYW "posture": no information on legal
    basis, means people will use it at they own risk, and then they will
    not be able to play against the author. <br>
    It seems the OSHWA "certification" process has been played well in
    this case: the author seemed to prefer to declare to not play
    certification, instead of declaring playing it but without
    respecting it. Maybe there was too much to lose to play
    certification compared to the gain: too much efforts to reach the
    requirements, or impossibility to reach the requirements because the
    basis on which this "creation" is delivered, are not valid, or
    difficult to be valid.<br>
    Who knows ...<br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Le 03/07/2016 22:45, Emilio Velis a
      écrit :<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAFMcv8WjXvdn=SXwQL=zaY4Vvmd-4dmiVscG0doW92U=AaaAcA@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
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      <div dir="ltr">Definitely. I'm curious on hearing opinions about
        how a certification can have a legal weight. I don't think that
        this is the case regarding intellectual property law, but I'd be
        really, really interested to know if there are any implications.
        This could actually be very beneficial to OSHWA.<br>
      </div>
      <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">On 3 July 2016 at 10:38, Jeffrey Warren
          <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="mailto:jeff@publiclab.org" target="_blank">jeff@publiclab.org</a>></span>
          wrote:<br>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote">
            <p dir="ltr">I'd be curious to hear too, maybe they mean
              that if they self-certify in the program, then violate the
              requirements, that they'd face compliance penalties? But
              those are not civil lawsuits, and they could be avoided
              simply by withdrawing from the program. It's pretty
              straightforward, so more info from them would be helpful.
            </p>
            <p dir="ltr">It's also a little frustrating, of course, to
              hear an unsupported opinion (esp. the "only" part) like
              that included as if it were somehow incontrovertible or
              self-evident, as I'd love to see more discussion instead
              of FUD. In any case, they should also be aware that they
              can of course be compliant with the open hardware
              definition (and so be "open hardware") without being in
              the certification program. </p>
            <div class="HOEnZb">
              <div class="h5">
                <div class="gmail_quote">On Jul 3, 2016 12:22 PM,
                  "Emilio Velis" <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="mailto:contacto@emiliovelis.com"
                    target="_blank">contacto@emiliovelis.com</a>>
                  wrote:<br type="attribution">
                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote">
                    <div dir="ltr">I wonder about that statement too.
                      Good catch, Nancy. I don't understand what kinds
                      of civil lawsuits the person refers to. Perhaps if
                      we write them they can explain it a bit
                      further...?<br>
                    </div>
                    <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                      <div class="gmail_quote">On 2 July 2016 at 23:56,
                        Nancy Ouyang <span dir="ltr"><<a
                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="mailto:nancy.ouyang@gmail.com"
                            target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nancy.ouyang@gmail.com">nancy.ouyang@gmail.com</a></a>></span>
                        wrote:<br>
                        <blockquote class="gmail_quote">
                          <div dir="ltr">
                            <p dir="ltr">Err, was more wondering about
                              the last phrase, "<span>the only thing
                                that certification adds to a project is
                                increased liability to civil suits,"
                                which I'm sure is a very unflattering
                                portrayal of the value that
                                certification adds, unless I'm very
                                confused.</span></p>
                            <p><span>Thanks,</span></p>
                            <p><span>--Nancy</span></p>
                            <div>
                              <div>
                                <div class="gmail_quote">On Jul 2, 2016
                                  12:45 PM, "Matt Maier" <<a
                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
                                    href="mailto:blueback09@gmail.com"
                                    target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:blueback09@gmail.com">blueback09@gmail.com</a></a>>
                                  wrote:<br type="attribution">
                                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote">
                                    <div dir="ltr">Everything is
                                      "explicitly not compliant" with
                                      the OSHWA certification by
                                      default. You have to opt-in.</div>
                                    <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                                      <div class="gmail_quote">On Sat,
                                        Jul 2, 2016 at 7:48 PM, Nancy
                                        Ouyang <span dir="ltr"><<a
                                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                                            href="mailto:nancy.ouyang@gmail.com"
                                            target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nancy.ouyang@gmail.com">nancy.ouyang@gmail.com</a></a>></span>
                                        wrote:<br>
                                        <blockquote class="gmail_quote">
                                          <div dir="ltr">
                                            <div>"This project is open
                                              source in the sense that I
                                              legally permit people to
                                              do whatever they want with
                                              the source code, design
                                              drawings, etc.; and in the
                                              sense that I provide that
                                              information for them to do
                                              what they want. It is
                                              EXPLICITLY NOT COMPLIANT
                                              with the OSHWA
                                              Certification. It never
                                              will be, because the only
                                              thing that certification
                                              adds to a project is
                                              increased liability to
                                              civil suits. "</div>
                                            <div><span><u><a
                                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://github.com/ab3nd/TinyRobo#oshw" target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://github.com/ab3nd/TinyRobo#oshw">https://github.com/ab3nd/TinyRobo#oshw</a></a></u></span><br>
                                            </div>
                                            <div><span><u><br>
                                                </u></span></div>
                                            <div>Is this simply a
                                              complaint about copyleft
                                              vs public domain, or is
                                              there more to it? Haven't
                                              been following the
                                              certification draft
                                              (beta?) discussion, sorry
                                              -- does anyone have a
                                              link? skimmed <a
                                                moz-do-not-send="true"
                                                href="http://oshwa.org/"
                                                target="_blank">oshwa.org</a> and
                                              didn't see anything in
                                              particular (though saw a
                                              discussion about the
                                              design of the mark i
                                              think)</div>
                                            <div><br>
                                            </div>
                                            <div>thanks,</div>
                                            <div>--nancy</div>
                                          </div>
                                          <br>
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